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The Quality of Stories and Poems

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Guest
Lurker
As a scientist I have been wondering about how one might measure the quality of a story or poem.

There seem to be only four criteria:
1. Number of reads - quantitative
2. Number of scores - quantitative
3. Average score - quantitative
4. Comments - qualitative

To maintain the high quality of Lush, it might be that stories and poems should be removed after a decent interval of time, say 9 months if they failed any of these criteria:
1. Fewer than 3,000 reads for a story or 100 reads for a poem
2. Fewer than 30 scores for a story or 10 scores for a poem
3. Average score below 4

Another suggestion could be that there should be two ways of scoring each story or poem:
1. Quality of the writing
2. Level of eroticism

I realise that if a quality control system were imposed most of my stories and poems would be removed, which might be a reflection of their quality, but I would still be interested in other authors views on this topic.
Guest
Lurker
I have to disagree with you. Some of the very best work (IMO) was written long ago..and I don't think they come on anymore, like Donato.

I'm sure that there are high standards in place already.

this is a bit insulting to the mods and the writers. you didn't piss me off but I can understand how the others feel.

I think your experiment failed.

hugs Will.

RejectReality
Testing The Waters.
There are only the loosest of grammar controls present on any of the other free erotica sites out there. Lush already has the strongest quality control system there is, and undoubtedly the strongest anti-plagiarism system of any other site. Lush is the only one I know of that regularly stops such stories before they see publication.

Asking for anything more from a free site ( at least as far as posting/reading stories are concerned ) is asking a lot.

And automated controls of the type you're suggesting are rife with potential to eradicate excellent stories that only lack in mass appeal.
Guest
Lurker
I was posing a hypothetical question rather than my personal view - which is typical of the way scientists think and work. I agree with both Daddysweetheart and RejectReaity who both make excellent points.
sprite
Her Royal Spriteness
writing is actually not a science. too bad. I always wanted to be Doctor Sprite, PhD. *sighs*

You can’t truly call yourself peaceful unless you are capable of violence. If you’re not capable of violence, you’re not peaceful. You’re harmless.
Buz
The Linebacker
Lush is a site for amateur writers to grow and develop their abilities. I think we currently have a much better site and system than any of the competition does. I really think seriously changing what already works would be detrimental. If its working, don't fix it.

The popularity of the site, massive numbers of story views and our ever growing number of story and poem submissions are proof that Lushstories is doing a great job as it is. I'm very happy with it.
Guest
Lurker
Quote by sprite
writing is actually not a science. too bad. I always wanted to be Doctor Sprite, PhD. *sighs*


Doctor Sprite sounds really rather good, so as far as Lush is concerned, why not? You could have a regular column 'Doctor Sprite's Tips for Budding Writers'
ChuckEPoo
Chuckanator
Quote by Buz
Lush is a site for amateur writers to grow and develop their abilities. I think we currently have a much better site and system than any of the competition does. I really think seriously changing what already works would be detrimental. If its working, don't fix it.

The popularity of the site, massive numbers of story views and our ever growing number of story and poem submissions are proof that Lushstories is doing a great job as it is. I'm very happy with it.



Yup. I agree. Mostly because I don't want most of mine removed. smile
Dani
Big-haired Bitch/Personality Hire
Quote by Will_greybeard
To maintain the high quality of Lush, it might be that stories and poems should be removed after a decent interval of time, say 9 months if they failed any of these criteria:
1. Fewer than 3,000 reads for a story or 100 reads for a poem
2. Fewer than 30 scores for a story or 10 scores for a poem
3. Average score below 4


What would removing stories and poems accomplish?

If a story/poem is enjoyed by even one member, then it's served its purpose.

░P░U░S░S░Y░ ░I░N░ ░B░I░O░
sprite
Her Royal Spriteness
Quote by Will_greybeard


Doctor Sprite sounds really rather good, so as far as Lush is concerned, why not? You could have a regular column 'Doctor Sprite's Tips for Budding Writers'



tip #1. never ever EVER piss me off.

You can’t truly call yourself peaceful unless you are capable of violence. If you’re not capable of violence, you’re not peaceful. You’re harmless.
Mysteria27
Prolific Writer
This idea seems really strange. I know I have a few favorite poems that are not that popular. But to me they are sensational.

This is people's art.

Seems silly.

Hugs,
Mysteria
Xo
sprite
Her Royal Spriteness
Quote by Will_greybeard


I realise that if a quality control system were imposed most of my stories and poems would be removed, which might be a reflection of their quality, but I would still be interested in other authors views on this topic.




make this easy. ain't ever going to happen. if an author decides to remove her/his own story, that's their business, but we're not going to start down that path. every story published here has been enjoyed by at least one person, and that's enough for me.

You can’t truly call yourself peaceful unless you are capable of violence. If you’re not capable of violence, you’re not peaceful. You’re harmless.
sprite
Her Royal Spriteness
Quote by Will_greybeard


To maintain the high quality of Lush, it might be that stories and poems should be removed after a decent interval of time, say 9 months if they failed any of these criteria:
1. Fewer than 3,000 reads for a story or 100 reads for a poem
2. Fewer than 30 scores for a story or 10 scores for a poem
3. Average score below 4




also, for the record, i have stories that, under your criteria, would be removed and i like to think that i'm a fairly decent writer. not smacking you down, btw, just reassuring the rest of our authors that they have nothing to worry about (except for Dancing Doll - love to get her stories pulled down - she makes me look bad. bitch).

You can’t truly call yourself peaceful unless you are capable of violence. If you’re not capable of violence, you’re not peaceful. You’re harmless.
noll
"insensitive prick!" – Danielle Algo
You seem to imply that quality of poems/stories is something purely objective. I think it's far from, and that the way stories/poems are judged for their quality can change over time. By readers giving scores/comments on the works you have some meta data for which to filter for those deemed to have the best quality, without the need to lose some of your source material.

BTW, I don't really see why avarage score is quantitative and comments are qualitative? Is it because the scores are numbers (but which could also stand for bad, poor, avarage, good and excellent) or is it because it's an avarage score?


===  Not ALL LIVES MATTER until BLACK LIVES MATTER  ===
Beffer
Rainbow Warrior
Page hits don't equate to reading the whole story or poem. I'm sure the number of 'reads' is actually more indicative of how well a title or one-liner grabs the curiosity. Once it does, the page click registers as a read, but probably only a fraction of that count are actually people who wind up reading the whole story. Many will try a few lines, or do a casual perusal, and then get bored and move on. Trying to quantify story/poem quality by the number of 'reads' is pretty meaningless.

Dr. Sprite is right. Writing is an art, not a science, otherwise computers would be writing best-sellers. Lush is fine the way it is. Applying science to quantify art never yields favorable results.
Guest
Lurker
"I have come, I have seen and written." Without a doubt Lush has proved the best. The more I write, the more I become polished. It's due to the mods that have made me wax my mistakes. There are no easy roads if one is just wishing to write a poem or story with no streets or suburbs befitting. "Sometimes quality is in the eye of the reader." What one sees as emeralds. the other may view as dismal.
Guest
Lurker
Quote by sprite



tip #1. never ever EVER piss me off.


Sorry, I wasn't trying to piss you off, I thought it sounded sort of cute, but I'm afraid my humour is a little heavy handed. Apologies
sprite
Her Royal Spriteness
Quote by Will_greybeard


Sorry, I wasn't trying to piss you off, I thought it sounded sort of cute, but I'm afraid my humour is a little heavy handed. Apologies


lol - that wasn't directed at you, Will, just me being "funny". no worries. (makes a call and calls off the ninja assassination team ).

You can’t truly call yourself peaceful unless you are capable of violence. If you’re not capable of violence, you’re not peaceful. You’re harmless.
Guest
Lurker
First of all - my apologies to every one that I have pissed off, which is almost everybody. Just put it down to pre senile dementia. Elizabeth said I should say I was just a bit touched by the sun, but those of you who know anything about Manchester would know that water on the brain would be more likely. I will now go and crawl into a big hole in the ground for a few months, unless someone can come up with a suitable penance.
noll
"insensitive prick!" – Danielle Algo
Quote by Will_greybeard
First of all - my apologies to every one that I have pissed off, which is almost everybody.


I don't think anyone was pissed off.


===  Not ALL LIVES MATTER until BLACK LIVES MATTER  ===
avrgblkgrl
In-House Sapiosexual
Where to start...
SMH
Naw, I better leave this one alone and blow bubbles.
? A True Story ?
sprite
Her Royal Spriteness
Quote by avrgblkgrl
Where to start...
SMH
Naw, I better leave this one alone and blow bubbles.
\

bubbles. *sighs* i love bubbles. heart

You can’t truly call yourself peaceful unless you are capable of violence. If you’re not capable of violence, you’re not peaceful. You’re harmless.
noll
"insensitive prick!" – Danielle Algo
Quote by sprite
bubbles. *sighs* i love bubbles. heart


You live in one!


===  Not ALL LIVES MATTER until BLACK LIVES MATTER  ===
Guest
Lurker
Quote by Will_greybeard
As a scientist I have been wondering about how one might measure the quality of a story or poem.
To maintain the high quality of Lush, it might be that stories and poems should be removed after a decent interval of time, say 9 months if they failed any of these criteria:
1. Fewer than 3,000 reads for a story or 100 reads for a poem
2. Fewer than 30 scores for a story or 10 scores for a poem
3. Average score below 4

Another suggestion could be that there should be two ways of scoring each story or poem:
1. Quality of the writing
2. Level of eroticism


I think your suggestion of scoring stories and poems by judging quality of writing and level of eroticism is pretty decent. I'd love Lush to consider this. But the question is, do we have such qualified people here to do that....
Guest
Lurker
Quote by avrgblkgrl
Where to start...
SMH
Naw, I better leave this one alone and blow bubbles.


I'd love to hear your input NOW!
Guest
Lurker
Quote by Will_greybeard
As a scientist I have been wondering about how one might measure the quality of a story or poem.

Another suggestion could be that there should be two ways of scoring each story or poem:
1. Quality of the writing
2. Level of eroticism



I think I like this idea - offering 2 means of scoring, neither required.

Of course, around here scores tend to default to 4s and 5s. So the scale is really a matter of 4.89 vs 5 vs 4.58. So slight.

But I do like being able to separate '5 for sex' VS '5 for writing'. Not everyone cares about quality of writing - some do, and I'm one of them.
Magical_felix
Wild at Heart
A story, in any genre, is good if it sparks your sense of wonder, curiosity, imagination or moves you in any way. Big or small.

Trying to apply theory or numbers to that is silly.
DanielleX
Head Penguin
Quote by Will_greybeard
As a scientist I have been wondering about how one might measure the quality of a story or poem.

There seem to be only four criteria:
1. Number of reads - quantitative
2. Number of scores - quantitative
3. Average score - quantitative
4. Comments - qualitative

To maintain the high quality of Lush, it might be that stories and poems should be removed after a decent interval of time, say 9 months if they failed any of these criteria:
1. Fewer than 3,000 reads for a story or 100 reads for a poem
2. Fewer than 30 scores for a story or 10 scores for a poem
3. Average score below 4

Another suggestion could be that there should be two ways of scoring each story or poem:
1. Quality of the writing
2. Level of eroticism

I realise that if a quality control system were imposed most of my stories and poems would be removed, which might be a reflection of their quality, but I would still be interested in other authors views on this topic.




I think you over-looking some confounding variables in your assessment of the erotic story.

The number of reads is not associated with the quality of a story as such, in an isolated sense. It is associated with the popularity of (i) the author and (ii) the popularity of the genre.

The number of scores is probably correlated to the number of reads, but I have no data on that.

The average score is a good measure, but can be biased by 'forced comments.' Forcing a comment deters trolls and mean people, who are less likely to score low if they have to justify it with a comment.

I agree that Comments are a good measure but difficult to quantify. Maybe you could agree on a selection of key words and rank the words.

Using your second scenario, there are more problems:

How do you measure quality of writing? This has a very high, though not entirely subjective element.

Level eroticism. I don't know how you would measure this, since what some people find erotic, others find a turn off.

Danielle

A First Class Service Ch.5

A steamy lesbian three way
Guest
Lurker
Quote by DanielleX


I think you over-looking some confounding variables in your assessment of the erotic story.

The number of reads is not associated with the quality of a story as such, in an isolated sense. It is associated with the popularity of (i) the author and (ii) the popularity of the genre.

The number of scores is probably correlated to the number of reads, but I have no data on that.

The average score is a good measure, but can be biased by 'forced comments.' Forcing a comment deters trolls and mean people, who are less likely to score low if they have to justify it with a comment.

I agree that Comments are a good measure but difficult to quantify. Maybe you could agree on a selection of key words and rank the words.

Using your second scenario, there are more problems:

How do you measure quality of writing? This has a very high, though not entirely subjective element.

Level eroticism. I don't know how you would measure this, since what some people find erotic, others find a turn off.

Danielle



Danielle, thank you for your intelligent and considered response

In my original post I did not mention confounding factors, but among the most important are the age and gender of the writer, and the number of friends that they have, as well as the story genre, number of words, and I also suspect, the tags that the author adds to their story rather than the title. The choices that writers make in their settings are also highly significant.

Regarding forced comments, I dislike these, not because what I write would be any different from a freely given comment, but because of the sheer difficulty involved in writing in the little box when using a mini iPad. Sometimes I will write a brief comment, press return, then write a fuller comment, and delete the original.

In the final analysis, you are absolutely correct, judgement on stories is entirely subjective.

I would add that I admire and respect the work that the moderators do, and I know that many stories are rejected. How they have the patience to wade through everything they are sent is beyond me, but I suspect it is much like marking examination papers, a chore which I am glad to say, is now in the past as far as I am concerned - marking dozens of scripts was the closest I have known to purgatory.