Israel-Palestine Conflict

This is a topic that's been popping up in a number of threads, so we might as well gather all these conversations in one place instead of side-tracking other threads.

Two things to start: First, it would be helpful for some people to catch up on the history of the conflict. The NY times ran a fairly detailed piece on it recently if you need to get up to speed.

Secondly, actual hate speech will be dealt with by mods as it has always been (post removal, suspension, banning, as each case may require). However, being critical of the actions of Palestinians or Israelis is not the same thing as being antisemitic or islamophobic. Israel and Palestine do not represent all jews or muslims. Nor do the acts of violence on either side represent all Israelis or Palestinians as a people. There are real issues to be resolved, but we won't get there by defensively silencing each other.

From "Elon Musk is Awesome"

Quote by ElCoco

Musk is right: “From the river to the sea” is a call to destroy Israel. “Decolonization” is a word that, as applied to the Middle East, means doing away with Israel and its Jewish inhabitants. If Musk follows through on his pledge, Twitter will suspend many accounts.

It will be interesting to see how some people react. They’ve been denouncing Musk and Twitter for not acting decisively against “hate speech;” I suspect that in this case, they'll say, “That’s not the hate speech we meant!”

Quote by Ironic

Yes, “From the river to the sea” is a call to destroy Israel. It's even written into the constitution of terrorist organizations.

I don’t think acknowledging racism or genocide as a valid point of view is the heart of an adult conversation.

In fact I would call it downright childish to claim that the same argument used to defend civil rights activists during the darkest and most oppressive times is also used to defend the wholesale murder of tens of thousands of innocent civilians.

Also saying ‘violence is not the answer’ is incredibly easy to say when it’s not your family being starved to death or shot in the street. The practice of non-violence is only effective if violence has a repercussion.

For better or worse, the attacks in Israel drew eyes to the violence of the Israeli people on the Palenstians. It’s kicked up awareness and support worldwide and actually created a rift in America’s blind militaristic support of Israel.

First off what you mean so antisemitism is a form of racism, not vice versa. Secondly, this is a view point that only works if you consider Jews to be a race, which is an oddly outdated point of view to have.

Secondly you don’t have to be pro-Hamas to be anti-Israel. You can point out the rise is Hamas was largely due to the Israeli treatment of the people of Gaza and the land theft that led to Israel’s founding. Of course it’s also prominent because the US military and CIA spent about 20 years building it up and overthrowing governments in the region.

Yeah, assuming that just because you believe Israel is a sovereign nation doesn’t make it so. I have grandparents older than Israel. It’s stolen land taken and occupied by an invading force. Colonials like to toss around the term ‘sovereignty’ like it means something other than a claim to power over certain people.

Antisemitism is hate against Jews, who are a religious group in its core. Citing an editable dictionary as to if it’s racism is not a strong argument, particularly when the issue is highly debated among the Jewish community. Those who consider it racism tend to be the same group that supports Israel, which is certainly something all Jews do not agree with.

It’s been stated before, I’ll reiterate: The mindless link-posting without added substance to actually contribute to the subject at hand, especially in efforts to shut down opposing viewpoints, needs to stop. If you don’t have the range to actually engage in the conversation without the postering, you need not participate. Please and thank you.

If I have to remove another post from this thread, it will simply be locked.

Thread locked due to having to remove a post by Chryses after the previous announcement/warning.