I ofter hear that one of the main rules when writing a story, is that the reader must connect with the protagonist, or main characters, there must be empathy, a bond between characters and reader, so the reader cares about what happens to the characters, and relates to their feelings.
I think that's wrong. If you want to write a story full of lowlives who wouldnt ever get any sympathy at all from any reader good writers should be able to.
What do you think?
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Sympathy for the characters.
If you have no link with the characters, why read it? Sympathy is simply a link with the characters, something that ties the reader to them somehow. If you don't care about the main character(s), you wont enjoy the story. Reading about something you don't care about is like reading a textbook or assembly instructions. There must be some emotional tie, even if its hatred for the protagonist, something ... the whole idea of a story is to emotionally involve you, if you don't have that, you don't have a story.
Would you want to read a story about a bunch of low-lives you don't care about? Where's the hook?
Would you want to read a story about a bunch of low-lives you don't care about? Where's the hook?
Active Ink Slinger
I dont think the word sympathy is correct, I think you mean empathy. You can empathise with what the main character is feeling, this could mean you feel sorry for them, but you could also wish you were them or get turned on by what is happening to them or what they are doing to others.
When i write i empathy for my character, turned on by what happens to her, although I dont ever what to go through it myself its a fantasy that I can describe and enjoy as its not real.
Damn, I sound like Im on happy pills - some of you would know what I mean!
When i write i empathy for my character, turned on by what happens to her, although I dont ever what to go through it myself its a fantasy that I can describe and enjoy as its not real.
Damn, I sound like Im on happy pills - some of you would know what I mean!
UK Born Pakistani Sex Stories Author. Writes about Reluctance/Manipulation.
Read my latest work http://www.lushstories.com/stories/reluctance/lawhore-in-lahore-part-one.aspx
Internet Philosopher
I have to disagree with the concept of a good writer making a good story with unlikeable charactors. A writer may be able to make a low life charactor likeable, and thereby create the connection the reader needs, but if every charactor is truly, dull, boring or otherwise a piece of flotsome in the story, then the story itself will simply be the same. I guess what I'm saying is that the protagonist may be able to be dark, but he or she must still be someone we pull for. Otherwise, why read it?
Active Ink Slinger
I agree Milk, most of my "fans" (LOL @ Fans! I mean people who like my stories!) are males who love the male characters, they are usually evil manipulative bastards, but guys like that escapism side, most are nice people in real life who have evil thoughts which the male evil characters fulfil.
A good writer is someone who can build a character that is believable that people can turn them from 2D words into a 3D imagination.
A good writer is someone who can build a character that is believable that people can turn them from 2D words into a 3D imagination.
UK Born Pakistani Sex Stories Author. Writes about Reluctance/Manipulation.
Read my latest work http://www.lushstories.com/stories/reluctance/lawhore-in-lahore-part-one.aspx
Quote by Milik_The_Red
I have to disagree with the concept of a good writer making a good story with unlikeable charactors. A writer may be able to make a low life charactor likeable, and thereby create the connection the reader needs, but if every charactor is truly, dull, boring or otherwise a piece of flotsome in the story, then the story itself will simply be the same. I guess what I'm saying is that the protagonist may be able to be dark, but he or she must still be someone we pull for. Otherwise, why read it?
One of the classic films of all time was The Godfather, where the we find ourselves pulling for characters who are all pretty much on "the dark side" (except for Kay).
Artistic Tart
Quote by ali2teaseuQuote by Milik_The_Red
I have to disagree with the concept of a good writer making a good story with unlikeable charactors. A writer may be able to make a low life charactor likeable, and thereby create the connection the reader needs, but if every charactor is truly, dull, boring or otherwise a piece of flotsome in the story, then the story itself will simply be the same. I guess what I'm saying is that the protagonist may be able to be dark, but he or she must still be someone we pull for. Otherwise, why read it?
One of the classic films of all time was The Godfather, where the we find ourselves pulling for characters who are all pretty much on "the dark side" (except for Kay).
that is true. It takes a lot of talent to pull that off, having us pull for repugnant fools in the mob. Great movie no doubt.
Internet Philosopher
Quote by xXxFuckDollxXx
I agree Milk, most of my "fans" (LOL @ Fans! I mean people who like my stories!) are males who love the male characters, they are usually evil manipulative bastards, but guys like that escapism side, most are nice people in real life who have evil thoughts which the male evil characters fulfil.
A good writer is someone who can build a https://www.wf.com/mba/accounts/accountBalance.docharacter that is believable that people can turn them from 2D words into a 3D imagination.
Okay, now I've just got to read one of your stories!
Internet Philosopher
In my series, Kelly's Passion, the main charactor is a call girl. In the story I at least try to show her ups and downs, justifications and the dangers of her trade. I feel I've created a charactor that some would consider flawed, but that most would be able to feel for. It helped to add an antagonist that was truly evil. In his case a police officer. So the lines can be blurred, because it is the motivation, their thoughts and desires that make them likeable.
Quote by freefallin1309
If you have no link with the characters, why read it? Sympathy is simply a link with the characters, something that ties the reader to them somehow. If you don't care about the main character(s), you wont enjoy the story. Reading about something you don't care about is like reading a textbook or assembly instructions. There must be some emotional tie, even if its hatred for the protagonist, something ... the whole idea of a story is to emotionally involve you, if you don't have that, you don't have a story.
Would you want to read a story about a bunch of low-lives you don't care about? Where's the hook?
Good point. But I wonder why all the weight of the story must fall upon the characters? I mean, what about a kick-ass story so interesting in itself , that would be a page turner even if the characters were just like forniture?
Sometimes when you watch a Holywood movie, you feel like "the story was crap, but since -insert movie star name- was in there, then it's okay".
I think sometimes characters kidnaps the essence of the story, in my opinion.
Quote by javier
I ofter hear that one of the main rules when writing a story, is that the reader must connect with the protagonist, or main characters, there must be empathy, a bond between characters and reader, so the reader cares about what happens to the characters, and relates to their feelings.
I think that's wrong. If you want to write a story full of lowlives who wouldnt ever get any sympathy at all from any reader good writers should be able to.
What do you think?
I have read many a book where I have connected strongly with the, let's say, hero's and then there are some that was filled with lowlives. I have enjoyed both. It is the same with movies. Love a hero but there are times I just want to root for the villian. I so wanted for Sylar from Heroes to sometimes win the battle. Not just because I had a little crush on him but .....
I don't think it is necessary all the time to have a strong connection with the character if the plot of the story does not need it.
Quote by javier
Good point. But I wonder why all the weight of the story must fall upon the characters? I mean, what about a kick-ass story so interesting in itself , that would be a page turner even if the characters were just like forniture?
Sometimes when you watch a Holywood movie, you feel like "the story was crap, but since -insert movie star name- was in there, then it's okay".
I think sometimes characters kidnaps the essence of the story, in my opinion.
I think if you're not writing with characters, you are writing about a time, a place or an event that has nothing to do with the people in it, on it, or around it. By taking away characters with personalities you can connect with in some way, you are simply writing about one of those things ... a time, a place or an event, and it will be a descriptive, possibly creative documentary at best.
As far as Hollywood movies go, I have a love/hate relationship with them. It could be a great story, but if it's poorly acted or just has poor characters, it makes for a bad movie. Or you have a bad movie with good actors like you said. A good example of what you mentioned is Men Who Stare at Goats. This movie had some celebrity powerhouses in it, but the movie completely sucked and I want those 2 hours of my life back. (Sorry Wellmademale ... I liked ya in the Big Lebowski, but you didn't pull this one off).
A good character in a story should enhance the essence of the story and vice versa, there should be a balance and not a one sided kidnapping.
Alpha Blonde
I think as long as you can see some aspect of yourself in one of the main characters of a story, then it has the ability to draw you in. We all have a dark side (or at least I do), and I can still be compelled by an "evil or immoral character" provided I can understand the logic of their actions, however warped it might be.
Some of my favorite books have been ones where the main character incites more anger than empathy... but anger often translates into excitement, and I'm still wanting to know what will happen next.
Some of my favorite books have been ones where the main character incites more anger than empathy... but anger often translates into excitement, and I'm still wanting to know what will happen next.
Active Ink Slinger
This is a fascinating topic. In my own writing all of the characters - the good, the bad, and the incidental are me. Writing is an excellent way of bringing out all the latent aspects of your personality. Bring forth your inner murderer, your inner sadist, your inner demon; what harm can he do on the page? I've only recently started writing from a female perspective. I've enjoyed doing so very much and have found myself getting back in touch with my female side. My girlfriend seems to think this is good.
Quote by javierQuote by freefallin1309
If you have no link with the characters, why read it? Sympathy is simply a link with the characters, something that ties the reader to them somehow. If you don't care about the main character(s), you wont enjoy the story. Reading about something you don't care about is like reading a textbook or assembly instructions. There must be some emotional tie, even if its hatred for the protagonist, something ... the whole idea of a story is to emotionally involve you, if you don't have that, you don't have a story.
Would you want to read a story about a bunch of low-lives you don't care about? Where's the hook?
Good point. But I wonder why all the weight of the story must fall upon the characters? I mean, what about a kick-ass story so interesting in itself , that would be a page turner even if the characters were just like forniture?
I think sometimes characters kidnaps the essence of the story, in my opinion.
Characters define a story especially an erotic one.Erotica is a sexual relation between one or many different characters(depending on your genre) You have to look at them and think why would I want to sleep with this character? And remember that not all people are all bad or all good. Some low lives might have a criminal background but be great fathers or an church going good person might have a wicked sexy side that likes bondage. The Hook is to make that person have something there even if it is isn't obvious will make the story believable. Even with the greatest plot on the planet- If you main protaganist or character is flat and unbelievable and unlikeable you'll lose the interest of your reader.
I think practically everyone here has made some kind of good point about storytelling. In the end, is sympathy for the characters in the story necessary for readers to enjoy it? In my opinion, not at all. But just writing a sloppy story where none of the characters have any likeable qualities or, at least, motives the audience can understand is going to churn out a piece of shit. Whether it be sympathy, empathy, a personal connection, good-and-bad qualities in the characters, or just a plot so engaging you need to know next to nothing about the characters, there needs to be some kind of hook, something that grabs you.
Just haphazardly writing a piece that pays no attention to creating engaging characters, an engaging plot, or even an engaging subtext is going to get looked over in a heartbeat. Every story needs something, it's simply up to the author to figure out what they want to say. Want to write a story where all the characters are scumbags with no redeeming qualities?...cool! Just make sure there's something else about the story to draw people in...an interesting setting, a fast-paced and intriguing plot, an inovative storytelling method, something. Just don't be lazy and expect people to like the fruits of no effort.
Just haphazardly writing a piece that pays no attention to creating engaging characters, an engaging plot, or even an engaging subtext is going to get looked over in a heartbeat. Every story needs something, it's simply up to the author to figure out what they want to say. Want to write a story where all the characters are scumbags with no redeeming qualities?...cool! Just make sure there's something else about the story to draw people in...an interesting setting, a fast-paced and intriguing plot, an inovative storytelling method, something. Just don't be lazy and expect people to like the fruits of no effort.